Why is manual OC better than OC auto. by the BIOS ?

[hochoi]

Please explain Why manual OC is better than OC auto. by the BIOS .

Thank you
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ASUS P4P800 SE
3.0 Ghz Overclocking to 3.39 Ghz. (225Ghz)
Temp: Idle: 40F, Fan: 2600RPM, Max: 53F :)

Know little, learn slowly but still happy :)

[Google]

[ToggleHead]

hey guys...sorry to jump in and be an annoying mod for a second here....but can someone explain this to poor Hochoi...lol

Im slammed at work, and have been super busy lately.....i just don thave the time to write it out.

Someone write up a good one and we'll sticky it....!!!!
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[hochoi]

Thx, ToggleHead. I am still waiting
_________________
ASUS P4P800 SE
3.0 Ghz Overclocking to 3.39 Ghz. (225Ghz)
Temp: Idle: 40F, Fan: 2600RPM, Max: 53F :)

Know little, learn slowly but still happy :)

[fussnfeathers]

I'm not quite sure what you're asking..........do you mean a manual BIOS OC compared to a software utility in Windows, or do you mean manually setting the BIOS compared to using the "standard, performance, or turbo" mode offered by some BIOSes?

I'll just give the reasons why a full manual overclock is better, if you have a mobo with the proper BIOS, of course.

Overclocking doesn't mean just increasing the FSB (which most software programs do). It involves quite a bit more.

For example, my 2.8c P4 can easily overclock to 3.4ghz, but I have to do a few things to get it there.

Increasing the FSB is part of that, of course, but I also have to be able to lock my PCI/AGP bus. Raising the FSB alone also increases those speeds, which is not good.

You may also have to increase your voltage to the proc a little bit, in order to get enough juice flowing through it to speed up. Again, a stock BIOS or software utility cannot do this.

And, you will also have to manually tune your RAM settings. Using a stock "OC" setting raises your fsb, which also increases the speed of your RAM. Now, assuming you have good RAM, it might run fine at a higher clock speed, but the chances are very good that you'll have to do one of two things:

Change your divider to keep the RAM as close to stock speeds as possible (in my case, OC'ing to 3.4ghz makes my DDR 400 try to run at somewhere near DDR 466, which it just can't handle.

Or, If you have really good RAM, and it can run at the higher speeds, you'll want to manually change the latency settings. Higher speeds mean the possibility of more errors, and crashing. So, if you have RAM that runs at, say, CAS 2, you might have to raise it to CAS 3 to prevent a random reboot. While not technically slowing the RAM down, it does allow for that extra cycle for a bad data bit. Again, a software-based, or BIOS wizard will not do this for you.

Again, take my 2.8c as an example. Using Chaintech's Apogee program, I crash at a mere 3.0ghz overclock. Going through the BIOS, and manually tweaking, I've had it as high (stable) as 3.6ghz, but it was running a little too hot for my taste on air cooling. With a good watercooling setup, I'm sure I could squeeze a few more MHZ out of it.

In short, a good OC is a balancing act, made up of tweaking each component at the basest levels. No "instant overclock" program or BIOS setting is going to do that for you.
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Big enough to scare you

[hochoi]

Interesting!!! I undersatnd a bit of what you explained. In my case, the P4P800 SE bios allows me to choose 5%, 10%, 20% or 30% OC. I am not talking about "standard, performance, or turbo" mode.
_________________
ASUS P4P800 SE
3.0 Ghz Overclocking to 3.39 Ghz. (225Ghz)
Temp: Idle: 40F, Fan: 2600RPM, Max: 53F :)

Know little, learn slowly but still happy :)

[sandness]

Although yours is not labeled "standard, performance, or turbo" it is the same thing: simply a FSB booster. And, by no means, should you be able to get a stable running system with 20 or 30% FSB increase alone (system boots ≠ stable system). As FnF explained, there will be a bit more tweaking involved to get stable overclock.
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[ToggleHead]

[hochoi]

Many thanks for all the explaination. It's good that ToggleHead has same board :). You all already convinced me to OCing manually. And sandness is comletely right, too. My system is not very stable @ 20% :). I am about to move from AL to IL soon. I probably can start learning this stuff latest in September . It's fun to do it :)
_________________
ASUS P4P800 SE
3.0 Ghz Overclocking to 3.39 Ghz. (225Ghz)
Temp: Idle: 40F, Fan: 2600RPM, Max: 53F :)

Know little, learn slowly but still happy :)

[ToggleHead]

you know whwere you find us if you have questions!!!
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[hochoi]

for sure
_________________
ASUS P4P800 SE
3.0 Ghz Overclocking to 3.39 Ghz. (225Ghz)
Temp: Idle: 40F, Fan: 2600RPM, Max: 53F :)

Know little, learn slowly but still happy :)

[hochoi]

Hi all Masters,

I am back :). I look at the setting but there are a few things I do not know how to set. Please help me here.

CPU V-Core Voltage?

AGP VDDQ Voltage?

DRAM frequency?

CPU External Frequency?

Thank you very much.
_________________
ASUS P4P800 SE
3.0 Ghz Overclocking to 3.39 Ghz. (225Ghz)
Temp: Idle: 40F, Fan: 2600RPM, Max: 53F :)

Know little, learn slowly but still happy :)

[hochoi]

[fussnfeathers]

Hey, it's late at night, might take us a few minutes to get back to you.

CPU voltage..........do NOT MESS WITH THIS. It's only necessary to play with the CPU V core if you're trying for a major overclock. Even then, you only increase a tiny, tiny amount.

Same with AGP voltage. This setting allows extra power to flow to your AGP core, if it needs it. Again, ONLY FOR EXPERTS, and ONLY FOR EXTREME OVERCLOCKS. Leave that one alone.

DRAM frequency is your RAM speed, basically. Most good motherboards give you the option to keep your DRAM speed at the proper rate for your RAM, even if you increase the FSB. Or, if you have really good RAM, you could overclock DDR400 to DDR533, without raising your FSB for the proc.........not very likely, but ideally, it could be done. Likewise, if you're running mismatched RAM (not recommended), you could "force" a slower speed stick to match a higher speed stick........say, you have one DDR333 and one DDR400. The DRAM frequency setting in the BIOS allows you to "force" any RAM in the board to run at the speed you choose. Again, not something to really mess with, but not critical. If you overclock too far, you'll just shut down. You won't really damage anything. Ideally, though, leave this set at your current RAM speed. This way, if you OC using the FSB, your RAM won't speed up at the same rate.

CPU External Frequency is the FSB (Front Side Bus)

Read through the stickies here. The FSB is the number one way to overclock, there are probably hundreds of posts here regarding this bit. Increase the FSB, and you increase your CPU speed. I forget what proc you have, but most processors are listed at core speed, and FSB speed. So, my P4 2.8c 800mhz is a 2.8ghz core speed, which reaches that rate at 800mhz FSB. Increasing my FSB to, say, 820mhz increases my core speed to 3.1ghz, or thereabouts........which my proc may choke on. Same as the others..........incremental changes, and if you're not sure what it does, LEAVE IT ALONE.

Increasing any of these to an extreme degree can not only cause your system to fail to boot...........they can also destroy the hardware attached to your motherboard. Increase the CPUv to the max, same with the AGP, and increase the FSB 50mhz. Sit back and watch the sparks fly.
_________________
Big enough to scare you

[hochoi]

It's quite scary . I will try tomorrow and see what happens. Thx a lot.
_________________
ASUS P4P800 SE
3.0 Ghz Overclocking to 3.39 Ghz. (225Ghz)
Temp: Idle: 40F, Fan: 2600RPM, Max: 53F :)

Know little, learn slowly but still happy :)