Is it crushed or otherwise dead?

mhanley240 · TweakNOOB Joined: 02 Sep 2003 Posts: 105

Hey,

I have a P4 2.4C and my computer hasn't been working for a while, so today (after a few months) I tried to get it working again. After pulling the heatsink off, i noticed that there was a circlular indentation on the chip near the corner marked with the triangle. It is a pretty significant indentation, and I am unsure if this is how the chip is designed, or if some freak thing happened and now I have punctured the chip...

your help is appreciated

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fussnfeathers · Lord of the Tweak Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Posts: 2763

Smallish, sortof like a hole? That's normal. I have no idea what it's for, but all P4's have them.
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Ham_fisT · Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 7:54 pm Post subject:

the hole is there to release gasses produced in the curing of the epoxy used to attach the heatspreader, without it, the first time the core generated any heat, the gasses would expand, possibly damaging the heatspreaders effectiveness.
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smith.p.sean · Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 8:01 pm Post subject:

what were the circumstances when your computer stopped working? Were you having any problems, are there any components that you have already ruled out. Beofre playing with the cpu i would be looking at a failed hard drive or perhaps a broken vid card.
My. 2c
Give us some idea of the problem, and start testing ur components one by one. Can u get to bios?

mhanley240 · TweakNOOB Joined: 02 Sep 2003 Posts: 105

everything was working fine... then i decided to upgrade the heatsink. I pulled the mobo out and installed the heatsink according to directions- to my knowledge, it was installed correctly: it seemed to be snug, not crushing it and replaced all the parts back in the case. Turned the power switch and it sounded like it was going fine, but then nothing came up on the display. I use an ATI all in wonder 9800, so iI tried using the motherboard's included video, to no avail. When I turn the computer on, I can hear the hard drive spinning as well as the optical but I don't get any output on the monitor. I don't know if I have to change a setting in the BIOS to switch from the video card to the integrated graphics, but if so, I can't because i Can't see anything. I've cleared CMOS multiple times to try and revert it to the integrated graphics, but I make no progress. I am a little discouraged

smith.p.sean · Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 8:31 pm Post subject:

did you apply the right amount of thermal paste? have you tried downgrading to your old heatsink? Do you get any beeps. Try to reseat the graphics card.

mhanley240 · TweakNOOB Joined: 02 Sep 2003 Posts: 105

Have reaseated the graphics card numerous times. The thermal paste was a little on the excessive side, but could that cause a (for lack of a technical term) false start. Will try downgrading to previous heatsink.

fussnfeathers · Lord of the Tweak Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Posts: 2763

What he said ^^^

A proc that doesn't start at all is typical of three things: A heatsink/fan that isn't compatible with the processor, which will overheat immediately and prevent startup, a BIOS change that over- or under-volted the proc, or an improperly installed heatsink with not enough (or too much) thermal paste.

Not enough paste will prevent good heat transfer, too much will not only prevent good heat transfer, but can also leak down the sides of the proc and short out the pins.

What brand/model HSF did you upgrade to?
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mhanley240 · TweakNOOB Joined: 02 Sep 2003 Posts: 105

http://www.compusa.com/products/product_info.asp?product_code=314037&pfp=BROWSE

That's the heatsink

I had noticed that the paste had run down the sides, but did not appear to have run on the underside....still I suppose it could have seeped into the chip.... is that dead?

[KoG]^weaZel · Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2005 10:50 pm Post subject:

that doesnt sound like an overheated cpu. Even if the heatsink was making contact on just a small portion of the heat spreader it would work, bit not very well. It wouldnt cause the no video situation. That sounds more like something not installed properly or the mobo was killed by static.
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fussnfeathers · Lord of the Tweak Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Posts: 2763

Eh...........that really depends on the proc. The thermal protection on P4's will prevent it from starting if it hits 70c or so, which it'll do quite quickly if the HSF isn't making good contact. Had it happen a few times myself (remember my problem with the spacers under the mounting bracket?)

If the paste shorted out a couple of pins, it's probably fine. You just need to verrrrrrry carefully clean any paste off, and start with a nice, very thin layer on the proc. I put a tiny dab in the middle, then use a business card to spread it out evenly. You don't need much........it's only there to fill any tiny gaps between the HSF and proc.
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mhanley240 · TweakNOOB Joined: 02 Sep 2003 Posts: 105

OKay well now it's starting up and all. If i boot from the hard drive, it has the options: start windows normally, safe mode, safe mode with command ,... all of these options result in going to windows loading, but before the bar fills up, it restarts and goes back to the same choose how to start windows screen. if i try to run windows setup it results in the unmountable boot volume. the system only starts up if 1 memory module is located in slot 3, all others do not start up at all. I was wondering if this is motherboard related or something else....

ToggleHead · TWEAKGURU Joined: 03 Mar 2004 Posts: 4360 Location: Jersey

it might be memory related..... search google for memtest 86 and its instructions.... run that test and see what you come up with.....

does it matter what mem stick you have in slot three?
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smith.p.sean · Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:25 pm Post subject:

what did u do to get it to start up? did it just randomly start working? And like TH said, run memtest, and do all three memory modules when placed in slot 3 allow it to start or only one.

2old2care · Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 6:27 pm Post subject:

You've reset CMOS, so now you need to double check and verify the voltages of the cpu (vcore) and the memory. (Vdimm) Vcore should read back at 1.525 to 1.55 volts, Vdimm must be at least 2.6v, but you can start at 2.7 and try memtest86 and go up or down a tenth ( 0.1 ) as needed.
What motherboard is it?
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mhanley240 · TweakNOOB Joined: 02 Sep 2003 Posts: 105

I switched to an old motherboard (MSI 865PE) and it did that. When switchin back to a PC-Brands or something (el cheapo) micro -atx, i get nothing ... will tyr memtest.

[KoG]^weaZel · Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 7:33 pm Post subject:

the reason that you can't start windows with the MSI board is the windows install was for the previous motherboard. If that PC-Chips motherboard doesnt show any signs of life even after trying out different componants in it then i would pronounce it dead. And on that note would then install the MSI board and proceed with the memtest and all that good stuff.
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fussnfeathers · Lord of the Tweak Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Posts: 2763

^^^^ what he said. You can sometimes......sometimes get away without reinstalling, if it's the exact same chipset, but even the slightest change and Windows considers it to be a new machine, requiring a new install.
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mhanley240 · TweakNOOB Joined: 02 Sep 2003 Posts: 105

Ran memtest, all checked out. I tried to do a clean re-install of windows, but before I can choose to make new partitions and all that, it just goes straight to a "unmountable disc volume" or something alike. I know I have to redo the installation, but I can't figure out why I'm being thwarted. All my components work fine.

On a seperate note, I think the PC CHips board is a little screwy, so I'm giving up on that.

fussnfeathers · Lord of the Tweak Joined: 14 Dec 2004 Posts: 2763

Do you have access to a boot floppy, that will at least allow you to access a command prompt? If you do (even an old Win98 floppy will work) do a format and fdisk from a c prompt, then try installing Winders XtraPoopy.

While you're at it, make sure your hard drive jumpers are set properly.
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smith.p.sean · Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2005 8:27 pm Post subject:

^^^ what he said and perhaps try another hard drive if you got a spare lying around.

mhanley240 · TweakNOOB Joined: 02 Sep 2003 Posts: 105

Thank all of you for your help. It required a reformat via Windows 98 before I could format in XP. Now it seems to be working...just need a case now- Thanks guys.